As Rowan and Lara know all too well, life isn’t always fair.
We wish it was, but since it isn’t, we tackled ways we can make the best of situations that don’t feel just. We mostly did this with butter tart and cupboard door examples, though we didn’t always see eye to eye on some key points in said examples (don’t get Rowan started on the importance of the butter tart unless you want a debate on your hands).
Let us know in the comments if you have anything to add to the conversation (about fairness OR butter tarts. Just… remember how sensitive Rowan is).
Things we referenced in the episode
Want more of Lara and Rowan?
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Transcript
Please note : we don’t edit these automatically generated transcripts carefully so there may be some errors.
00:00:00] Rowan: A lot of life is things that happen to us. And a lot of what kind of joy and happiness and connection and peace that we find is how we choose to deal with those things. . Thanks
for joining us on this week's episode of Unboxing It. I'm Rowan.
[00:00:41] Lara: And I'm Lara.
[00:00:42] Rowan: And today we're talking about a topic that it's a thing that I say all the time and I have to check myself, but fairness, and you know when something happens and you go. That's not fair. Mm-hmm. That's not fair.
Right?
[00:00:58] Lara: Yeah, it's not fair. It's a big feeling that can be really crushing or just like veer you off when you feel it.
[00:01:10] Rowan: It's that sense of injustice for me. And I think in part, like, I wanna talk about why we chose this topic. We chose it because there's this idea when we're growing up, I think that life should be fair.
That everything should be balanced. You know, and, I wanna preface this by saying I'm a human rights advocate, so I am all about equity. I want to see people have the same opportunities as other people, no matter who they are, where they come from. And I will continue to always fight for that, but in my own life.
I can feel a sense of injustice, like it is nobody's business. I do not like injustice when I feel that something isn't fair. I haven't been given a fair shake. I've been dealt a worse hand than somebody else. I can stew in that for days sometimes. I don't know about you,
Lara.
[00:02:12] Lara: Yeah, I think it's really easy to get into this really angry place where it's not fair, how come I have to deal with this and you don't have to deal with this? why am I dealt this hand? And it's difficult to get through it when you feel like that. That's one of those things that brings up resentment
something that I think just poisons everything. Whenever you're in a moment of resentment, I think something needs to be fixed, which is, you know, all part and parcel of this conversation. What does it mean when something isn't fair? What do you do when something isn't fair? Do you have to accept that life isn't fair and just like let everybody rumble over you?
Or are there solutions, like what is the solution? So I think that's what we're gonna get to dig into because. There's lots of ways to look at this. There's lots of ways to think about this. There's a lot of ways to feel about this and I never think there's just one way through. So we're gonna talk about the different parts, the different strategies, the different ways to internalize all of this.
[00:03:17] Rowan: Where do you think the idea, like did you get your sense of fairness? Do you think It's taught to us by our parents. Do you think it's taught to us by school or the media? What do you think?
[00:03:29] Lara: Probably all of the above, right? again, just like all kinds of things, what we're taught in the words and then what we see in action are not always the same, right?
So like everything needs to be fair. There's law, there's judges, there's rules. And so we talk about it and I think this is probably one of the ways that we get all messed up about it, is we talk about it as in everything should be fair. Everything has a way of being. Everything has rules and rights and wrongs.
And then because in life that actually isn't true, right? Like there's so many gray areas, there's so much wiggle room on all of the sides that what we were told doesn't play out in real life. And so it feels like we're making a mistake. It feels like something isn't working when really. It was never meant to be that black and white.
[00:04:23] Rowan: Ooh.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think morals, we're taught morals, right? The difference between right and wrong, and I. I was raised Catholic, so that was drilled into me this idea. I mean like, look what Eve did with the Apple while she broke that rule. Well, obviously they should be cast out of the Garden of Eden and suffer.
Right? and that sort of permeates a lot of my thoughts around fairness. So, Again, I, want to say that privilege is a real thing and that there are people born into or find themselves in situations that are unjust. Like they don't get, the same starting point as someone else. Like I have very, very fair skin and I do not have to deal with racism, for example. And if somebody has to deal with racism that is truly unjust, that's not fair. And the fact that they can't, I. Have the same opportunities sometimes, or not have them as easily as I can because of the color of their skin is not right.
but I think what I wanna talk about more than that, because we have to keep fighting for equity. I, I truly believe that I. What I wanna talk about more is like when things happen to us personally, like a job loss or an illness or a breakup, or you know, just something that happens to us that maybe isn't happening to other people around us and maybe is, nothing to do with any decisions that we have made.
Any choices, any actions that can feel. Hugely unfair and I wanna explore how to deal with that.
[00:06:06] Lara: Yeah. So first, again, I think you and I are very much on the same page when it comes to privilege and understanding that there are things that should be improved in this world, but when it comes to what we have control over and how we can navigate certain conversations, I think it is a really big.
Important conversation and knowing that what feels unfair to us probably doesn't feel unfair to somebody else is also important, right? Like what feels fair and unfair might not be that black and white thing. So being able to think through what we're feeling, what other people are feeling, what the stories we're telling are around it, and how to navigate that is part of this.
[00:06:47] Rowan: I would love to know,
like, can you think off the top of your head of an example of something that maybe might feel unfair to me, but feels perfectly fine for you?, Not us specifically, obviously, but like what do you have an idea of like what that might feel like? I do, I have one that I can share.
And that is, I have somebody who. Talked to me recently about his job loss, and he said, you know, I lost my job and I've lost my job before. And I felt that was very unfair. And he lost his job. And he was like, well, that's just the way business is sometimes. and people downsize.
And honestly, I wasn't very happy there anyway. And so it just created an opportunity for me. And he sort of went on about that, right. But I was like, wow. Like you didn't have even a moment of being angry and he is like, no, I was more like relieved than anything. So that, I think it just depends on how you look at things sometimes, maybe.
[00:07:43] Lara: Yeah. I mean, that's a really interesting one because part of the reaction to the same situation was based on how. You felt going into it, right? So if you're like, I didn't really like this job anyway, what a relief that I don't have to quit. I don't have to tell people that I quit a perfectly good job with nothing lined up after because it wasn't my fault because they downsized me, right?
Like it becomes this freedom giving situation, whereas to somebody else who wanted to stay in that job, it does not feel like that at all. And. Is that a fair or unfair thing, or is it just a how you react to a thing that happened to you and you know, is it fair if you were downsized because honestly the company was in, a lot of financial trouble and they truly needed to downsize?
Or if they downsized, you just downsized, quote unquote, as an excuse to get rid of somebody that they just. Didn't want around anymore. And you know that, right? Like there are differences other than just straight they downsized. That would help make you feel fair or unfair. But I also think a lot of people
tend to lean one way or the other, like when things happen, it's unfair, or when things happen. I guess we figure out what comes next, right? Like there are different ways that people tend to feel and think in a common way. Does that make sense?
[00:09:10] Rowan: Oh, it makes total sense. I mean, I know I started this by saying that when I feel something's unfair, I can stew in it for days.
And, that is still true to some extent. I can have these situations where I'm like, oh, it's not fair. It's not right, and I'm really angry about it, and I can stay there for a while that resentment can build and that's something that I am working on as a human being. But there also have been plenty of times in my life where I have had something unfair or what I might feel is unfair happen to me and.
I recognize fairly quickly that this is something that has pushed me outta my comfort zone. That's why I'm upset about it, and that it can be, if I leverage it properly, an opportunity for personal growth. And that includes the illnesses that I have because I live with some chronic illnesses I know that chronic illnesses suck.
Honestly, it's not fun to have them. If I could wave a magic wand, I certainly would get rid of them. It's not like I want to keep them around, but I have them. So now that I have them and there's nothing I can do about it, and yeah, it's not fair that I have them, I also can look at it as, what can I learn from this?
What can I learn about myself? How can I challenge myself? How can I take steps to make my life better while living with this illness? And I think that is how I manage a lot of those things that happened to me that frankly would've knocked me down a few years ago and I would've not have known how to get back up.
Well, it sounds like a Chumba, Womba song, but here we're. Gen X humor, everybody.
[00:10:50] Lara: There you go. And, and as you were talking, the thing I was thinking about too, that I feel most often that I get stuck in it not being fair is also health, right? Like illnesses. It's like it's not fair that I have been dealt the hand that I've been dealt.
It's not fair that some of my family members have been dealt the hand that they've been dealt. Like it's not fair, but also like that's not a thing anybody can change. like it isn't fair, but also nobody specifically did this to us. Like it's not a person who was like, you know what? And that they can change it.
And so based on what's true, even if it's sucks, what do I want to feel? Do I wanna be angry about it or do I wanna figure out what to do In this case so that I don't feel angry about it.
[00:11:40] Rowan: Yeah. At the end of the day, do I want to harm myself further living with anger, living unhappily,
and the answer to me is, no, no. I want to move through those feelings. I wanna acknowledge those feelings. And I think no matter how much work we do on ourselves, there's not a second where I would say to people, oh yeah, immediately when something happens to me that is awful.
I go, oh, this is a great growth opportunity. No. Now that comes after my very, very human feelings, my very immediate reaction of, no, this isn't right. I'm so upset that this is happening. Then after that, once I allow those feelings, and I will sometimes just consciously say to myself, let the feeling move through you.
Don't hold it back. Don't try to talk yourself out of it. Literally let it go through your body and out of your body, because if I don't do that, it gets stuck in my body. And again, with chronic illness, that's not something that's good because stress could exacerbate a lot of that, right? So I have to let those feelings out and then I can pick up the pieces after everything and start working through things again.
[00:12:58] Lara: I think we talked about this in our episode about unexpected change because I know somebody mentioned this whole it's okay to feel the feelings came up then too, and I think that that is huge, that letting yourself feel the feelings that it's okay to be upset, that it's okay to be sad, that you don't need to pretend you're fine all of the time.
Hugely a part of this. Let yourself have emotions. The more you let yourself have the emotions and let them be okay and let yourself sort of resolve them, the less you're going to have that stewing mentality, right? Like, I'm not saying, okay, feel the feelings and keep them in forever. You deserve to get to do that you know, let yourself feel them and then. I believe mindset, beliefs are hugely important and if we understand that so much can be easier for us because mindset and how we step through
what our life is,
if we have a bad mindset, it's harder. Like, do you know what I mean? Like all things being exactly the same.
If we can figure out what we have control over and take action based on what we have control over, we can make a situation better without somebody else having to realize they were wrong without somebody else having to apologize, right? without somebody else, whoever it is having to do anything.
There are some things that just based on how we feel and think about things can make our lives easier.
[00:14:31] Rowan: Yeah, One of the things I had to
learn and really acknowledge and it's not a nice thing, but life isn't fair. And I'm not saying that like my grandpa would say it, right?
Well just suck it up because life isn't fair, but truly. Truly, really, life isn't fair. The first mindset shift for me is acknowledging that life isn't fair and not to expect it to be fair. I can still fight for equity, I can still fight for people's rights. I can still fight to get what I feel I deserve in life for sure.
But as a general rule, if you just watch a Nature documentary and you will see it, clear as day. Life is not set up to be fair. It is set up to be challenging. For whatever reason, whether you call that, divinity or whether it's just the universe created this chaotic planet that we live on.
Life is about struggle. In part, it's also about joy and happiness and all those things, but those things we tend to create ourselves. A lot of life is things that happen to us. And a lot of what kind of joy and happiness and connection and peace that we find is how we choose to deal with those things.
[00:15:46] Lara: Yeah, I think that one of the biggest differences can also be if you think life is happening to you, I think I might have said this in a different podcast too. Is life happening to you or are you happening to life? And so
you don't have control if it's happening to you.
You have more control if you're like, I am happening to it.
So just that small difference of not feeling like you have any ability to control a situation, to thinking you do have ability, even if it's just to be like, I'm not gonna let this ruin my day, or I'm not gonna let it ruin my year. Right? Like, it's okay if it ruined my day, but we're not gonna let it ruin.
Everything else moving forward and deciding what you wanna do about that. Okay, so here's a silly example, but it is one of the ones I feel like happens in our house about what's not fair. So let's say I bought a pack of six Butter Tarts.
[00:16:37] Rowan: I love Butter Tarts. So go on.
[00:16:40] Lara: There's five people in my family, but one person doesn't like butter Tarts, so that's okay.
So now there's.
Six butter tarts and four people, who
gets a second one?
[00:16:49] Rowan: Well, that's the no, you, you send them to me. Obviously you send me the extras, but, but if you can't do that, who does get the extra?
[00:16:58] Lara: And so we have a tendency to have things like, okay, so within a certain timeframe, if you want another one ask, we'll split it.
If you were one of the four people and by day three you didn't even eat your first one, I think you're out.
[00:17:12] Rowan: Right? Yeah. That's the role we had in our big family too. It is. Growing up it was like that. And with my own family of six, it was like that same thing.
[00:17:20] Lara: Right? But the feeling is it's not fair that I didn't get mine.
I was like, well, it's not fair that you left it on the counter taunting us.
[00:17:28] Rowan: Right. Agreed.
[00:17:30] Lara: And so what is the solution? The solution could be that if you know you really want it, that you're gonna take it out of the box, you're gonna put it in a container, you'll put your name on it, and you're gonna say, this one's mine. I have set it aside. It's for me. I don't wanna eat it right now, but I know I want it.
If you just assume that we're gonna sit there and look at it for days and days and days without finally giving into the temptation of eating it because you don't seem to want it. I think that's on you.
[00:17:55] Rowan: First of all, I don't understand anyone who can look at a butter tarp for three days and not eat it, but, you know,
[00:18:01] Lara: fair enough.
[00:18:01] Rowan: You, I guess. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, it's true, right? Like it's about taking that action no matter what I you have to take some action. It's also really, about knowing what you can control and what you can't control. So I might not be able to control. That I, you know, am sick with something.
But I can control what I do about that. You know, do I follow my doctor's advice, yes or no? Do I take supplements? Yes or no? I find moments of happiness and joy and actually seek those out? Whenever I feel I need to, yes or no, do I find ways to live in ways, you know, that suit me where I'm at today, yes or no?
Those are all things that I have control over and they make the situation feel less unjust, right? It makes me feel like I am still living with the situation that I have been presented with the things that I can't control.
[00:18:59] Lara: Yeah. And if you believe that some of the things are happening to you, we're gonna go back to the butter Tarts for a minute, but if you believe that the fact that somebody ate the Butter Tart that was supposed to be yours was really disrespectful and really rude and unkind,
[00:19:15] Rowan: I mean it is, but go on..
[00:19:15] Lara: You're gonna be like, angry and full of like, like this? And you think they really wanted it, and they figured I didn't. And both of those scenarios could happen, right? With nothing being different. The person who didn't get a Butter Tart could feel really angry and resentful and feel like other people were being unfair to them.
Or they could be like, oh, I guess I didn't get one. maybe next time I'm gonna say, you know what, last time I didn't get any, I'm gonna get an extra one. Whether or not that works out in the Battle of the Butter Tarts is another conversation. But you like, that's a thing you could say in response.
[00:19:55] Rowan: Exactly. you're bringing up a really sensitive topic for me.
[00:19:58] Lara: The Butter Tarts. I know. I'm sorry.
[00:20:00] Rowan: I mean, that would be a situation that challenged me. There's this place, , about an hour. I'm, I'm going off on a journey now. There's this place about an hour from Toronto East called Dodos Bakery.
Shout out Dodos Bakery. It's in the middle of nowhere, and you pull up and they have truly the best butter tars I've ever had. But you don't even have to take my word for it, because there is literally a wall. Of awards like medals, medal after medal after, pin, after trophy. I mean, it's so impressive because of Butter Tarts are freaking amazing.
They're so good. If somebody ate my butter Tart because I didn't eat it for a day or two, my dooo butter tart. there would be war in my house. There would be war. Because I'd be like, no, you should all know that I love Butter Tarts and how dare you not check in with me. there, there are just, there are just some things you can't control my friend and that might be one of them.
[00:20:59] Lara: Yeah. Again, I wanna be like, did you buy the Butter Tarts? If you bought the Butter Tarts? Then people should understand that they are mostly your butter tarts.
[00:21:08] Rowan: This, this is actually an episode on Butter Tarts. It's not,
[00:21:11] Lara: It's an episode on butter tarts..
[00:21:13] Rowan: It's actually just about butter. Oh. What is a butter tart for people who are not Canadian?
Okay. Think. Pecan pie or a sugar pie or something along those lines. Butter tarts. They're a Canadian staple. They're very sweet. They're made with like maple syrup and butter, and they have a nice little crust and they're delicious. Yeah, definitely look them up.
They're yummy, yummy, yummy. And sometimes they have things like pecans and sometimes they have raisins, and there's a lot of debate about that. But that is a whole different episode.
[00:21:42] Lara: Yeah, because it isn't actually an episode about Butter Tarts. It's just a really you know, what I liked about the Butter Tart example is it really isn't super consequential, right?
So if we think about life and fairness, okay, I'm sorry Rowan's face, for those who can't see it disagrees that butter tarts, not that consequential.
[00:22:01] Rowan: Very consequential,
[00:22:04] Lara: but it's not like a high stakes. Situation, right? Like losing a job. But we still can get really upset about it. And when we talk through like the littler things and what it means to us and how we feel about it and why we feel that way, because some of it, when it's not fair takes on.
That's what the whole stories we tell the meaning now is, you don't respect me. You think you're more important than me, or you don't even think about me. And so that is a really big meaning you're putting on, you ate my Butter Tart.
[00:22:37] Rowan: Yep.
[00:22:38] Lara: And sometimes you can think about it with these small examples because when you think about the big examples, the feelings, imagine, right?
If you feel that way about somebody eating your butter tart, if you're talking about something. Way more consequential in your life. It's gonna be even more filled with emotions and harder to sort of see the other side.
[00:22:57] Rowan: Well, we kind of, you know, I had a roommate at one point who, wouldn't do the dishes.
not always. Sometimes they would do the dishes, but most of the time I would be doing the dishes and. It was very easy for a while for me to look at that as, this person doesn't care. This person just doesn't care if it's messy. This person doesn't respect me.
I have made it clear that this is really important to me, that I can't be doing this all the time. That we have to share that. You know? And I kind of went on about, and I created this whole story in my head about how this person, I think towards the end of it, it was like they get up, they throw their dishes on the counter.
And they kinda go, eh, who gives a crap? And then they just like, you know, and it's like, because they just don't care at all. But I don't wanna speak too much for this person, but like, they had other things going on. There were a lot of other things going on, mental health things you know, and neurodivergence and, things that sort of made it so that they were not looking at chores in the house in the same way that I was. It had nothing to do with how they saw me, how much they respected me or didn't how much they cared about our home or didn't. It had everything to do with where, they were in life. And was it fair that I had to clean up more than they did?
No, it wasn't fair. In a very fair situation, we'd be doing half and half, but it wasn't because they were trying to get away with something and they were carrying a very big load in their own life. And it was, you know, honestly, once I realize that so much easier, just go, oh, you know what? They're not able to get to it today.
I'll do it. I think it can be very easy when things don't feel fair to fall into a victim mentality.
[00:24:49] Lara: Mm-hmm.
[00:24:50] Rowan: When we tell ourselves all those stories, all the things you were saying, all the things I was just saying, , that's a victim mentality. Right. To stay stuck in it is a victim mentality and approaching life from that.
Standpoint from a lot of experience is one of the worst things you can do because it doesn't make anything more fair. It just makes
you feel a whole lot worse.
[00:25:13] Lara: And I agree with everything right down to, you know, somebody not even realizing they're doing something. But knowing that somebody might receive it as a very intentional slight, right.
So I told you that it's important for me to do the dishes, and if you don't do them, it feels disrespectful. And the other person being like, I didn't do the dishes right. Like, as clear as Oh.. so one of the things I remember I was very lucky. I had a roommate for a couple of years and we didn't.
Have a lot of conflict. But I remember one day she was like, why do you leave all of the cabinet doors open all the time?
And I was like, I do. Right? Like it wasn't like intentionally
being like, how about I make this kitchen look silly with all of the cabinet doors open so you can see inside and then just being in the way.
It's like for me, I opened it, I took the thing, and then like I was done and no part of me remembered to close it. And I know that other people feel this way. And it's so funny now every time I walk into my kitchen and every single cabinet door is open, because I know it was probably multiple of my family members came into multiple cabinets.
None of them remembered to close the cabinet doors. And it was, it's such a big thing that I know happens in my family that when we had our big renovation, I said, are there self-closing cabinets? And she said, no. Very disappointed.
[00:26:35] Rowan: And you know what? My partner does that too. I
always know when she's been in the kitchen, because there is at least.
One cabinet or one drawer that's left open. And I also go around the house and turn off lights after she's been in a room. The other day I asked her to turn off the light in the bathroom. Our bathroom has multiple lights. There's like a light for around the vanity. There's a light above the bathtub and there's a light in the shower.
And she said, no problem. I'll turn off the lights when I'm done. So I left afterwards and I, went downstairs and said, I'm very proud of you. You turned off the lights. The vanity lights. You did however, leave on the light above the bathtub, the light in the shower.
That's okay. Because you thought to yourself, I don't want Rowan to have to run around and turn off all the lights. You forgot a couple, but I really appreciate that you did that. I could have turned around and been like. You left the lights on again. You know, like, it's such a small thing in the grand scheme of things, but it's just an example of like, I saw that and I went, she really did try, you know, like she really did try and I appreciate that she made the effort, even if I had to still go and turn off the lights after,
[00:27:53] Lara: because I think a lot of the time, probably not all of the time, but a lot of the time, the thing that.
Doesn't feel fair is also about feeling disrespectful, right? Like, that person doesn't respect me enough to do this thing. And if that's not actually the case, right? Like it just, it lets you take some of the gasoline out of the fire when you think, okay. Yeah, this isn't fair, but what can we do? And so, and the other is the what can we do, right?
I mean, the perfect solution would've been those self-closing cupboards that I said I wanted, right? Yes. Like what can we do? Like, have them all close themselves, right? Like every 20 minutes if there's still open, like close 'em. Fantastic. It could be that, you know, splitting chores in a way where it's, , you know what, I'll do all the dishes, but can you do all the garbage?
And in that situation, maybe the other person doesn't mind doing the garbage. It's easy for them to do it. You don't mind doing the dishes. They hate doing it. Like, what is the solution that you can find where it doesn't have to be, you know, that, image, you probably have seen it where the imagery is like a fence and you're looking over at, let's say a baseball game and everybody has a like one foot step stool to look over the fence. But one of you is five feet tall. One of you is six feet tall, and one of you is seven feet tall. Very tall people.
[00:29:14] Rowan: That's Bigfoot at that point, by the way.
[00:29:16] Lara: But there are seven feet tall people, foot tall people.
[00:29:18] Rowan: I suppose it's true.
[00:29:19] Lara: But standing on the step stool is not gonna do the same thing if the fence is six and a half feet tall and you stood on a one foot step stool,
[00:29:30] Rowan: right. And
[00:29:31] Lara: you're five foot tall.
So it's not all about just doing what's equal
and what's fair isn't always just what's equal.
[00:29:41] Rowan: That's right. That's right.
[00:29:42] Lara: And so. When you think about it and when you think like, how do I adjust for a person, if I feel like it's not fair that something is happening, can we adjust it so that it works for both of us? Most of the time people aren't trying to be shitty to you. Like I know sometimes they are, but most of the time it's not intentionally shitty.
It's, well, this is what works for me.
[00:30:07] Rowan: That's right. A lot of the feelings that come about
when it comes to fairness have to do with the story we're telling ourselves. So what can really help me on top of, you know, before I'm able to calm down enough to come up with solutions, and you have some very good solutions there.
What helps me is. Asking myself, what do I know is true about this situation and what am I making up right? So what I know is true, for example, in the case of the roommate, is the dishes are not being done equally. I am doing most of the dishes. Everything else is something that I'm telling myself that is a story.
now, I could also say, and my roommate is home a lot more than I am, and still the dishes are not being done. That part might also be true. I have also talked to my roommate and things have not gotten better. Also true, but any feelings, any assumptions that I'm making about why the dishes aren't being done.
That's all made up or how that reflects upon me and how this person sees me also made up, right? So I have to remove all of the emotion and just look at the facts. And if I look at the facts, it takes the edge off. And then I can start finding out why. Now, why isn't this happening? Why not? What I've made up in my head, I'm not gonna go to the person and go, and you just don't care enough to do this, right?
Because that's, I don't know that. I'll use another example. So as a bigger person, and we talked about this on our fatness episode, but as a larger person. I was taught for a long time by society, by medical professionals, pretty much that anything that happens that is bad in my body is because I'm a bigger person.
Mm-hmm.
So, you know, I broke out in a rash recently, this like really awful rash all over my arms and my first thought was it's because I'm not taking care of myself. Right. that's not helpful. Like that's not gonna help me, right? So I have to be able to step back and go, no.
What's actually going on? All I know is I broke out in this rash. Is it because of something I'm doing? I don't know. Is it because of something I'm not doing? I don't know. And it turned out it was an infection that really had nothing to do with me, but for like three or four days, I had convinced myself this was somehow my fault and I had to fix it.
And finally my partner was like, can you just go to the doctor and stop being a stubborn man? Like, just go to the doctor. The doctor's like, here's some antibiotics. And then it went away, right? But that's the story of this. Stories are so powerful, and that's an example of how I suffered for another several days because I assumed it was me and I could somehow fix the problem by treating my body better.
So when we're talking about. How to look at a situation, whether it is fairness or anything else. It's really important to take the story element out.
[00:33:16] Lara: Yeah, the story is huge and , let's say what you think is happening is even true. we're gonna talk about dishes some more.
Podcast episode about Butter Tart and dishes. And I once was talking to somebody who really wanted their partner to do more of the dishes and she said when they do the dishes, they like clank around and they seem really hostile. And so then I end up taking back over and I was like, well, what if you just decide that they really like doing dishes aggressively?
And leave them alone to do it how they want,
the responsibility of them doing the dishes and being happy about it, like Right. Versus doing the dishes because you asked them to. Right. Like, that's two different asks and it, they don't have to enjoy it for it to be fair that they did it.
[00:34:06] Rowan: Yeah. That's the other thing, like, don't make other people's emotions your responsibility.
Obviously we don't wanna hurt anybody, right? Like, I don't wanna go outta my way to make someone feel bad, but people don't have to like the work that they do around the house either. I don't exactly like the work I do around the house. but I do it. So I think that's a really good point.
you're just smart. Except for the butter tart thing. 'cause I, I do still, I disagree with you there, that that's a very serious injustice. When somebody does eat the butter tarts that are supposed to be yours. But I digress. fairness. life is not fair. But
I think if I've taken
anything out of this episode,
it's to r emind myself when I feel that things are unfair,
take a step back and take
my own advice and
yours and really
pay attention to the story I'm telling myself around the perceived injustice, and
also feel my feelings and then do what I can about it.
[00:35:13] Lara: Yeah, I think that's great. This has been a good conversation.
I would like to invite people to come into the comments on our substack and tell us if you have anything to add to it. Something that I have very much enjoyed since we launched the podcast is all the people who come to me and tell me. I was listening to this episode and I was thinking this, and I have this thought and I had this counterpoint, and so I love that the podcast is getting people thinking.
And I wanna keep hearing from more people what it is that it's getting them thinking. 'cause I think that will be fodder for more episodes and follow up episodes.
[00:35:47] Rowan: Absolutely. I would love to do an episode where we get people's thoughts on other episodes their ideas, their takes on things, and talk about those because we don't know everything.
We're just two people.
[00:36:00] Lara: With lots
of thoughts!
[00:36:01] Rowan: We have lots of thoughts. You have even more thoughts, so please do share them with us, and thank you for joining us on this episode.
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